廣弘明集 21.18

21.18

Wang Gui, Attendant Gentleman of the Excellency over the Masses, inquired: "I do not yet know: since ultimate and conventional are not identical, how can the meaning of mutual identity be attained?"
The imperial decree answered: "What the sage attains of itself sees its non-being; what the ordinary person attains of itself sees its being. The seeings are of themselves not identical; this does not prevent the conventional from not extending outside the ultimate."
[Wang Gui] also inquired: "I do not yet know: since there is no difference in substance yet there are two meanings, is the meaning separated from the essence, or is the meaning identical to the essence?"
The imperial decree answered: "Not going beyond one another is named one essence; the foolish and the sage seeing differently of itself constitutes distinct meanings."
[Wang Gui] also inquired: "Do ordinary beings only see the conventional, or do they also get to see the ultimate?"
The imperial decree answered: "They only get to see the conventional; they do not get to see the ultimate."
[Wang Gui] also inquired: "Since the essences are mutually identical, how could they not behold the ultimate?"
The imperial decree answered: "If ordinary beings saw the ultimate, they should not behold the conventional. Since beholding the conventional is delusion, how could they see the ultimate?"