Kathavatthu 4.4: Samannāgatakathā

4.4.1.1

Arahā catūhi phalehi samannāgatoti?

Is an arahant endowed with four fruits?

Theravādin: You say, in fact, that an Arahant is endowed with all the Four Fruits, a Never-Returner with three, a Once-Returner with two. Then you must also admit that an Arahant is endowed with four contacts, four feelings, four perceptions, four volitions, four thoughts, four faiths, energies, mindfulnesses, concentrations, understandings; the Never-Returner with three of each, the Once-Returner with two of each—which you must deny.

4.4.1.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.1.3

Arahā catūhi phassehi catūhi vedanāhi catūhi saññāhi catūhi cetanāhi catūhi cittehi catūhi saddhāhi catūhi vīriyehi catūhi satīhi catūhi samādhīhi catūhi paññāhi samannāgatoti?

Is an arahant endowed with four contacts, four feelings, four perceptions, four volitions, four consciousnesses, four faiths, four energies, four mindfulnesses, four samādhis, four wisdoms?

4.4.1.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.2.1

Anāgāmī tīhi phalehi samannāgatoti?

Is a non-returner endowed with three fruits?

4.4.2.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.2.3

Anāgāmī tīhi phassehi …pe… tīhi paññāhi samannāgatoti?

Is a non-returner endowed with three contacts …pe… endowed with three wisdoms?

4.4.2.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.3.1

Sakadāgāmī dvīhi phalehi samannāgatoti?

Is a once-returner endowed with two fruits?

4.4.3.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.3.3

Sakadāgāmī dvīhi phassehi …pe… dvīhi paññāhi samannāgatoti?

Is a once-returner endowed with two contacts …pe… endowed with two wisdoms?

4.4.3.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.4.1

Arahā sotāpattiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is an arahant endowed with the fruit of stream-entry?

Again, if an Arahant is endowed with the first fruition, the second, and the third, he must be one of whom the characteristics of all three classes of the first, of the second, and of all five classes of the third stages are true. Then he would be rightly described as in one and all at the same time—which is absurd. The same argument holds for those who have realized the Third and the Second Fruit.

4.4.4.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.4.3

Arahā sotāpanno sattakkhattuparamo, kolaṅkolo, ekabījīti?

Is an arahant a stream-enterer, one who has seven births at most, one who goes from family to family, a single-seeder?

4.4.4.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe…

It should not be said thus …pe…

4.4.4.5

arahā sakadāgāmiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is an arahant endowed with the fruit of once-returning?

4.4.4.6

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.4.7

Arahā sakadāgāmīti?

Is an arahant a once-returner?

4.4.4.8

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe…

It should not be said thus …pe…

4.4.4.9

arahā anāgāmiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is an arahant endowed with the fruit of non-returning?

4.4.4.10

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.4.11

Arahā anāgāmī, antarāparinibbāyī, upahaccaparinibbāyī, asaṅkhāraparinibbāyī, sasaṅkhāraparinibbāyī, uddhaṃsoto akaniṭṭhagāmīti?

Is an arahant a non-returner, one who attains final unbinding halfway through, one who attains final unbinding upon landing, one who attains final unbinding without exertion, one who attains final unbinding with exertion, one who goes upstream to the Akaniṭṭha realm?

4.4.4.12

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.5.1

Anāgāmī sotāpattiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is a non-returner endowed with the fruit of stream-entry?

4.4.5.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.5.3

Anāgāmī sotāpanno sattakkhattuparamo, kolaṅkolo, ekabījīti?

Is a non-returner a stream-enterer, one who has seven births at most, one who goes from family to family, a single-seeder?

4.4.5.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe…

It should not be said thus …pe…

4.4.5.5

anāgāmī sakadāgāmiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is a non-returner endowed with the fruit of once-returning?

4.4.5.6

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.5.7

Anāgāmī sakadāgāmīti?

Is a non-returner a once-returner?

4.4.5.8

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.6.1

Sakadāgāmī sotāpattiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is a once-returner endowed with the fruit of stream-entry?

4.4.6.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.6.3

Sakadāgāmī sotāpanno sattakkhattuparamo, kolaṅkolo, ekabījīti?

Is a once-returner a stream-enterer, one who has seven births at most, one who goes from family to family, a single-seeder?

4.4.6.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.7.1

Sotāpattiphalena samannāgato “sotāpanno”ti vattabboti?

Should one endowed with the fruit of stream-entry be spoken of as a “stream-enterer”?

Again, you admit that one who is endowed with the Fruit of Stream-Winning is rightly called “Stream-Winner”. But is the same person both Stream-Winner and Arahant? Similarly for the two other fruitions. Similarly, is the same person both Never-Returner and Stream-Winner, or both Once-Returner and Never-Returner?

4.4.7.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.7.3

Arahā sotāpattiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is an arahant endowed with the fruit of stream-entry?

4.4.7.4

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.7.5

Sveva arahā, so sotāpannoti?

Is that very same one an arahant, [and also] that stream-enterer?

4.4.7.6

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.8.1

Sakadāgāmiphalena samannāgato “sakadāgāmī”ti vattabboti?

Should one endowed with the fruit of once-returning be spoken of as a “once-returner”?

4.4.8.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.8.3

Arahā sakadāgāmiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is an arahant endowed with the fruit of once-returning?

4.4.8.4

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.8.5

Sveva arahā, so sakadāgāmīti?

Is that very same one an arahant, [and also] that once-returner?

4.4.8.6

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.9.1

Anāgāmiphalena samannāgato “anāgāmī”ti vattabboti?

Should one endowed with the fruit of non-returning be spoken of as a “non-returner”?

4.4.9.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.9.3

Arahā anāgāmiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is an arahant endowed with the fruit of non-returning?

4.4.9.4

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.9.5

Sveva arahā, so anāgāmīti?

Is that very same one an arahant, [and also] that non-returner?

4.4.9.6

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.10.1

Sotāpattiphalena samannāgato “sotāpanno”ti vattabboti?

Should one endowed with the fruit of stream-entry be spoken of as a “stream-enterer”?

4.4.10.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.10.3

Anāgāmī sotāpattiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is a non-returner endowed with the fruit of stream-entry?

4.4.10.4

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.10.5

Sveva anāgāmī, so sotāpannoti?

Is that very same one a non-returner, [and also] that stream-enterer?

4.4.10.6

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.11.1

Sakadāgāmiphalena samannāgato “sakadāgāmī”ti vattabboti?

Should one endowed with the fruit of once-returning be spoken of as a “once-returner”?

4.4.11.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.11.3

Anāgāmī sakadāgāmiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is a non-returner endowed with the fruit of once-returning?

4.4.11.4

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.11.5

Sveva anāgāmī, so sakadāgāmīti?

Is that very same one a non-returner, [and also] that once-returner?

4.4.11.6

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.12.1

Sotāpattiphalena samannāgato “sotāpanno”ti vattabboti?

Should one endowed with the fruit of stream-entry be called a “stream-enterer”?

4.4.12.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.12.3

Sakadāgāmī sotāpattiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is a once-returner endowed with the fruit of stream-entry?

4.4.12.4

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.12.5

Sveva sakadāgāmī, so sotāpannoti?

Is that very once-returner a stream-enterer?

4.4.12.6

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.13.1

Arahā sotāpattiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is an arahant endowed with the fruit of stream-entry?

Would you not admit that the Arahant had evolved past the Fruit of the First Path? Yes, you say; then you cannot maintain your proposition;

4.4.13.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

Would you not admit that the Arahant had evolved past the Fruit of the First Path? Yes, you say; then you cannot maintain your proposition;

4.4.13.3

Nanu arahā sotāpattiphalaṃ vītivattoti?

Has not an arahant transcended the fruit of stream-entry?

Would you not admit that the Arahant had evolved past the Fruit of the First Path? Yes, you say; then you cannot maintain your proposition;

4.4.13.4

Āmantā.

Yes.

Would you not admit that the Arahant had evolved past the Fruit of the First Path? Yes, you say; then you cannot maintain your proposition;

4.4.13.5

Hañci arahā sotāpattiphalaṃ vītivatto, no ca vata re vattabbe—

If an arahant has transcended the fruit of stream-entry, then surely, friend, it should not be said—

Would you not admit that the Arahant had evolved past the Fruit of the First Path? Yes, you say; then you cannot maintain your proposition;

4.4.13.6

“arahā sotāpattiphalena samannāgato”ti.

“An arahant is endowed with the fruit of stream-entry.”

Would you not admit that the Arahant had evolved past the Fruit of the First Path? Yes, you say; then you cannot maintain your proposition;

4.4.14.1

Arahā sotāpattiphalaṃ vītivatto tena samannāgatoti?

Has an arahant transcended the fruit of stream-entry and [yet] is endowed with it?

Because, if you are to maintain consistently that the Arahant is yet endowed with that Path and that Fruit out of and past which he has evolved, you must further ascribe to him all those corruptions out of which the Stream-Winner evolves—which is absurd. Similarly for the other Paths and Fruits. And similarly for the Never-Returner and the Once-Returner.

4.4.14.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.14.3

Arahā sotāpattimaggaṃ vītivatto, sakkāyadiṭṭhiṃ vicikicchaṃ sīlabbataparāmāsaṃ, apāyagamanīyaṃ rāgaṃ, apāyagamanīyaṃ dosaṃ, apāyagamanīyaṃ mohaṃ vītivatto tena samannāgatoti?

Has an arahant transcended the path of stream-entry, transcended identity view, doubt, adherence to rules and observances, lust leading to states of loss, hatred leading to states of loss, delusion leading to states of loss, and [yet] is endowed with them?

4.4.14.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.15.1

Arahā sakadāgāmiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is an arahant endowed with the fruit of once-returning?

4.4.15.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.15.3

Nanu arahā sakadāgāmiphalaṃ vītivattoti?

Has not an arahant transcended the fruit of once-returning?

4.4.15.4

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.15.5

Hañci arahā sakadāgāmiphalaṃ vītivatto, no ca vata re vattabbe—

If an arahant has transcended the fruit of once-returning, then surely, friend, it should not be said—

4.4.15.6

“arahā sakadāgāmiphalena samannāgato”ti.

“An arahant is endowed with the fruit of once-returning.”

4.4.16.1

Arahā sakadāgāmiphalaṃ vītivatto tena samannāgatoti?

Has an arahant transcended the fruit of once-returning and [yet] is endowed with it?

4.4.16.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.16.3

Arahā sakadāgāmimaggaṃ vītivatto, oḷārikaṃ kāmarāgaṃ, oḷārikaṃ byāpādaṃ vītivatto tena samannāgatoti?

Has an arahant transcended the path of once-returning, transcended coarse sensual lust, coarse ill will, and [yet] is endowed with them?

4.4.16.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.17.1

Arahā anāgāmiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is an arahant endowed with the fruit of non-returning?

4.4.17.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.17.3

Nanu arahā anāgāmiphalaṃ vītivattoti?

Has not an arahant transcended the fruit of non-returning?

4.4.17.4

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.17.5

Hañci arahā anāgāmiphalaṃ vītivatto, no ca vata re vattabbe—

If an arahant has transcended the fruit of non-returning, then surely, friend, it should not be said—

4.4.17.6

“arahā anāgāmiphalena samannāgato”ti.

“An arahant is endowed with the fruit of non-returning.”

4.4.18.1

Arahā anāgāmiphalaṃ vītivatto tena samannāgatoti?

Has an arahant transcended the fruit of non-returning and [yet] is endowed with it?

4.4.18.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.18.3

Arahā anāgāmimaggaṃ vītivatto, aṇusahagataṃ kāmarāgaṃ, aṇusahagataṃ byāpādaṃ vītivatto tena samannāgatoti?

Has an arahant transcended the path of non-returning, transcended subtle sensual lust, subtle ill will, and [yet] is endowed with them?

4.4.18.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.19.1

Anāgāmī sotāpattiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is a non-returner endowed with the fruit of stream-entry?

4.4.19.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.19.3

Nanu anāgāmī sotāpattiphalaṃ vītivattoti?

Has not a non-returner transcended the fruit of stream-entry?

4.4.19.4

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.19.5

Hañci anāgāmī sotāpattiphalaṃ vītivatto, no ca vata re vattabbe—

If a non-returner has transcended the fruit of stream-entry, then surely, friend, it should not be said—

4.4.19.6

“anāgāmī sotāpattiphalena samannāgato”ti.

“A non-returner is endowed with the fruit of stream-entry.”

4.4.20.1

Anāgāmī sotāpattiphalaṃ vītivatto tena samannāgatoti?

Has a non-returner transcended the fruit of stream-entry and [yet] is endowed with it?

4.4.20.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.20.3

Anāgāmī sotāpattimaggaṃ vītivatto, sakkāyadiṭṭhiṃ …pe… apāyagamanīyaṃ mohaṃ vītivatto tena samannāgatoti?

Has a non-returner transcended the path of stream-entry, transcended identity view …pe… delusion leading to states of loss, and [yet] is endowed with them?

4.4.20.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.21.1

Anāgāmī sakadāgāmiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is a non-returner endowed with the fruit of once-returning?

4.4.21.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.21.3

Nanu anāgāmī sakadāgāmiphalaṃ vītivattoti?

Has not a non-returner transcended the fruit of once-returning?

4.4.21.4

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.21.5

Hañci anāgāmī sakadāgāmiphalaṃ vītivatto, no ca vata re vattabbe—

If a non-returner has transcended the fruit of once-returning, then surely, friend, it should not be said—

4.4.21.6

“anāgāmī sakadāgāmiphalena samannāgato”ti.

“A non-returner is endowed with the fruit of once-returning.”

4.4.22.1

Anāgāmī sakadāgāmiphalaṃ vītivatto tena samannāgatoti?

Has a non-returner transcended the fruit of once-returning and [yet] is endowed with it?

4.4.22.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.22.3

Anāgāmī sakadāgāmimaggaṃ vītivatto, oḷārikaṃ kāmarāgaṃ, oḷārikaṃ byāpādaṃ vītivatto tena samannāgatoti?

Has a non-returner transcended the path of once-returning, transcended coarse sensual lust, coarse ill will, and [yet] is endowed with them?

4.4.22.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …pe….

4.4.23.1

Sakadāgāmī sotāpattiphalena samannāgatoti?

Is a once-returner endowed with the fruit of stream-entry?

4.4.23.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.23.3

Nanu sakadāgāmī sotāpattiphalaṃ vītivattoti?

Has not a once-returner transcended the fruit of stream-entry?

4.4.23.4

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.23.5

Hañci sakadāgāmī sotāpattiphalaṃ vītivatto, no ca vata re vattabbe—

If a once-returner has transcended the fruit of stream-entry, then surely, friend, it should not be said—

4.4.23.6

“sakadāgāmī sotāpattiphalena samannāgato”ti.

“A once-returner is endowed with the fruit of stream-entry.”

4.4.24.1

Sakadāgāmī sotāpattiphalaṃ vītivatto tena samannāgatoti?

[You agree that] a once-returner has transcended the fruit of stream-entry, [yet] is endowed with it?

4.4.24.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.24.3

Sakadāgāmī sotāpattimaggaṃ vītivatto, sakkāyadiṭṭhiṃ …pe… apāyagamanīyaṃ mohaṃ vītivatto tena samannāgatoti?

A once-returner has transcended the path of stream-entry, has transcended personality view … [pe] … has transcended delusion that leads to the states of deprivation, [yet] is endowed with that?

4.4.24.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus … [pe] ….

4.4.25.1

Na vattabbaṃ—

Should it not be said—

Uttarāpathaka: But if it be wrong to say that an Arahant is endowed with four Fruits, not one, a Never-Returner with three, not one, a Once-Returner with two, not one, do you deny that the Arahant has acquired four Fruits and has not fallen away from them, the Never-Returner three, and so on? You do not deny this. Hence it is right to say: They “are endowed with” four, three, two Fruits.

4.4.25.2

“arahā catūhi phalehi samannāgato”ti?

“An arahant is endowed with the four fruits”?

4.4.25.3

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.25.4

Nanu arahatā cattāri phalāni paṭiladdhāni tehi ca aparihīnoti?

Have not the four fruits been attained by an arahant, and he has not fallen away from them?

4.4.25.5

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.25.6

Hañci arahatā cattāri phalāni paṭiladdhāni tehi ca aparihīno, tena vata re vattabbe—

If the four fruits have been attained by an arahant and he has not fallen away from them, then indeed you should say:

4.4.25.7

“arahā catūhi phalehi samannāgato”ti.

“An arahant is endowed with the four fruits.”

4.4.26.1

Na vattabbaṃ—

Should it not be said:

4.4.26.2

“anāgāmī tīhi phalehi samannāgato”ti?

“A non-returner is endowed with three fruits”?

4.4.26.3

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.26.4

Nanu anāgāminā tīṇi phalāni paṭiladdhāni tehi ca aparihīnoti?

Have not three fruits been attained by a non-returner, and he has not fallen away from them?

4.4.26.5

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.26.6

Hañci anāgāminā tīṇi phalāni paṭiladdhāni tehi ca aparihīno, tena vata re vattabbe—

If three fruits have been attained by a non-returner and he has not fallen away from them, then indeed you should say:

4.4.26.7

“anāgāmī tīhi phalehi samannāgato”ti.

“A non-returner is endowed with three fruits.”

4.4.27.1

Na vattabbaṃ—

Should it not be said:

4.4.27.2

“sakadāgāmī dvīhi phalehi samannāgato”ti?

“A once-returner is endowed with two fruits”?

4.4.27.3

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.27.4

Nanu sakadāgāminā dve phalāni paṭiladdhāni tehi ca aparihīnoti?

Have not two fruits been attained by a once-returner, and he has not fallen away from them?

4.4.27.5

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.27.6

Hañci sakadāgāminā dve phalāni paṭiladdhāni tehi ca aparihīno, tena vata re vattabbe—

If two fruits have been attained by a once-returner and he has not fallen away from them, then indeed you should say:

4.4.27.7

“sakadāgāmī dvīhi phalehi samannāgato”ti.

“A once-returner is endowed with two fruits.”

4.4.28.1

Arahatā cattāri phalāni paṭiladdhāni tehi ca aparihīnoti, arahā catūhi phalehi samannāgatoti?

If four fruits have been attained by an arahant and he has not fallen away from them, is an arahant endowed with the four fruits?

Theravādin: I grant they have acquired them, and have not fallen away from them. But I say that, if you affirm that they are endowed with the Fruits, you must no less affirm a fortiori that they are endowed with the respective Paths. But by pushing the argument a step further, we have seen that you were landed in the absurdity of ascribing corruptions to saints.

4.4.28.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.28.3

Arahatā cattāro maggā paṭiladdhā tehi ca aparihīnoti, arahā catūhi maggehi samannāgatoti?

If four paths have been attained by an arahant and he has not fallen away from them, is an arahant endowed with the four paths?

4.4.28.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …

4.4.29.1

Anāgāminā tīṇi phalāni paṭiladdhāni tehi ca aparihīnoti, anāgāmī tīhi phalehi samannāgatoti?

If three fruits have been attained by a non-returner and he has not fallen away from them, is a non-returner endowed with three fruits?

4.4.29.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.29.3

Anāgāminā tayo maggā paṭiladdhā tehi ca aparihīnoti, anāgāmī tīhi maggehi samannāgatoti?

If three paths have been attained by a non-returner and he has not fallen away from them, is a non-returner endowed with three paths?

4.4.29.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …

4.4.30.1

Sakadāgāminā dve phalāni paṭiladdhāni tehi ca aparihīnoti, sakadāgāmī dvīhi phalehi samannāgatoti?

If two fruits have been attained by a once-returner and he has not fallen away from them, is a once-returner endowed with two fruits?

4.4.30.2

Āmantā.

Yes.

4.4.30.3

Sakadāgāminā dve maggā paṭiladdhā tehi ca aparihīnoti, sakadāgāmī dvīhi maggehi samannāgatoti?

If two paths have been attained by a once-returner and he has not fallen away from them, is a once-returner endowed with two paths?

4.4.30.4

Na hevaṃ vattabbe …pe….

It should not be said thus …

4.4.30.5

Samannāgatakathā niṭṭhitā.

The discussion on endowment is finished.