Viyahapannatti 7.3.349

7.3.349

se nūnaṃ bhaṃte! jā vedanā sā nijjarā? jā nijjarā sā vedanā?
goyamā! no iṇaṭṭhe samaṭṭhe|
se keṇaṭṭheṇaṃ bhaṃte! evaṃ vuccai–jā vedanā na sā nijjarā? jā nijjarā na sā vedanā?
goyamā! kammaṃ vedanā, nokammaṃ nijjarā| se teṇaṭṭheṇaṃ goyamā! evaṃ vuccai–jā vedanā na sā nijjarā, sā nijjarā na sā vedanā|
neraiyā ṇaṃ bhaṃte! jā vedanā sā nijjarā? jā nijjarā sā vedanā?
goyamā! no iṇaṭṭhe samaṭṭhe|
se keṇaṭṭheṇaṃ bhaṃte! evaṃ vuccai–neraiyāṇaṃ jā vedanā na sā nijjarā? jā nijjarā na sā vedanā?
goyamā! neraiyāṇaṃ kammaṃ vedanā, nokammaṃ nijjarā| se teṇaṭṭheṇaṃ goyamā! evaṃ vuccai–neraiyāṇaṃ jā vedanā na sā nijjarā, jā nijjarā na sā vedanā|
evaṃ jāva vemāṇiyāṇaṃ|
se nūnaṃ bhaṃte! jaṃ vedeṃsu taṃ nijjareṃsu? jaṃ nijjareṃsu taṃ vedeṃsu? no iṇaṭṭhe samaṭṭhe|
se keṇaṭṭheṇaṃ bhaṃte! evaṃ vuccai–jaṃ vedeṃsu no taṃ nijjareṃsu? jaṃ nijjareṃsu no taṃ vedeṃsu?
goyamā! kamma vedeṃsu, nokammaṃ nijjareṃsu| se teṇaṭṭheṇaṃ goyamā! jāva no taṃ vedeṃsu|
evaṃ neraiyā vi, evaṃ jāva vemāṇiyā|
se nūnaṃ bhaṃte! jaṃ vedeṃti taṃ nijjareṃti? jaṃ nijjareṃti taṃ vedeṃti?
goyamā! no iṇaṭṭhe samaṭṭhe|
se keṇaṭṭheṇaṃ bhaṃte! evaṃ vuccai–jāva no taṃ vedeṃti?
goyamā! kammaṃ vedeṃti, nokammaṃ nijjareṃti| se teṇaṭṭheṇaṃ goyamā! jāva no taṃ vedeṃti|
evaṃ neraiyā vi jāva vemāṇiyā|
se nūnaṃ bhaṃte! jaṃ vedissaṃti taṃ nijjarissaṃti? jaṃ nijjarissaṃti taṃ vedissaṃti?
goyamā! no iṇaṭṭhe samaṭṭhe|
se keṇaṭṭheṇaṃ jāva no taṃ vedissaṃti?
goyamā! kammaṃ vedissaṃti, nokammaṃ nijjarissaṃti| se teṇaṭṭheṇaṃ jāva no taṃ nijjarissaṃti|
evaṃ neraiyā vi jāva vemāṇiyā|
se nūnaṃ bhaṃte! je vedanāsamae se nijjarāsamae? je nijjarāsamae se vedanāsamae?
no iṇaṭṭhe samaṭṭhe|
se keṇaṭṭheṇaṃ bhaṃte! evaṃ vuccai–je vedanāsamae na se nijjarāsamae? je nijjarāsamae na se vedanāsamae?
goyamā! jaṃ samayaṃ vedeṃti no taṃ samayaṃ nijjareṃti, jaṃ samayaṃ nijjareṃti no taṃ samayaṃ vedeṃti–annammi samae vedeṃti, annammi samae nijjareṃti| anne se vedanāsamae, anne se nijjarāsamae| se teṇaṭṭheṇaṃ jāva na se vedanāsamae, na se nijjarāsamae|
neraiyā ṇaṃ bhaṃte! je vedanāsamae se nijjarāsamae? je nijjarāsamae se vedanāsamae?
goyamā! no iṇaṭṭhe samaṭṭhe|
se keṇaṭṭheṇaṃ bhaṃte! evaṃ vuccai–neraiyā ṇaṃ je vedanāsamae na se nijjarāsamae? je nijjarāsamae na se vedanāsamae?
goyamā! neraiyā ṇaṃ jaṃ samayaṃ vedeṃti no taṃ samayaṃ nijjareṃti, jaṃ samayaṃ nijjareṃti no taṃ samayaṃ vedeṃti–annammi samae vedeṃti, annammi samae nijjareṃti| anne se vedanāsamae, anne se nijjarāsamae| se teṇaṭṭheṇaṃ jāva na se vedanāsamae|
evaṃ jāva vemāṇiyāṇaṃ|

“Is it so, Venerable Sir, that what is experiencing is dissipation, and what is dissipation is experiencing?”
“Gautama! That meaning is not correct.”
“For what reason, Venerable Sir, is it said: ‘What is experiencing is not dissipation, and what is dissipation is not experiencing’?”
“Gautama! Experiencing is karma, dissipation is non-karma (nokarma). For that reason, Gautama, it is said: ‘What is experiencing is not dissipation, and what is dissipation is not experiencing.’
Venerable Sir, is what is experiencing for the inhabitants of hell dissipation, and what is dissipation experiencing?”
“Gautama! That meaning is not correct.”
“For what reason, Venerable Sir, is it said: ‘For the inhabitants of hell, what is experiencing is not dissipation, and what is dissipation is not experiencing’?”
“Gautama! For the inhabitants of hell, experiencing is karma, dissipation is non-karma. For that reason, Gautama, it is said: ‘For the inhabitants of hell, what is experiencing is not dissipation, and what is dissipation is not experiencing.’
In this way, up to the celestial beings (vaimānikas).
‘Is it so, Venerable Sir, that what they experienced, they dissipated; what they dissipated, they experienced?’
‘That meaning is not correct.’
‘For what reason, Venerable Sir, is it said: “What they experienced, they did not dissipate; what they dissipated, they did not experience”?’
‘Gautama! They experienced karma; they dissipated non-karma. For that reason, Gautama, up to: they did not experience it.’
In this way also for the inhabitants of hell, in this way up to the celestial beings.
‘Is it so, Venerable Sir, that what they experience, they dissipate; what they dissipate, they experience?’
‘Gautama! That meaning is not correct.’
‘For what reason, Venerable Sir, is it said—up to: they do not experience it?’
‘Gautama! They experience karma; they dissipate non-karma. For that reason, Gautama, up to: they do not experience it.’
In this way also for the inhabitants of hell, up to the celestial beings.
‘Is it so, Venerable Sir, that what they will experience, they will dissipate; what they will dissipate, they will experience?’
‘Gautama! That meaning is not correct.’
‘For what reason, up to: they will not experience it?’
‘Gautama! They will experience karma; they will dissipate non-karma. For that reason, up to: they will not dissipate it.’
In this way also for the inhabitants of hell, up to the celestial beings.
‘Is it so, Venerable Sir, that the time-instant of experiencing is the time-instant of dissipation, and the time-instant of dissipation is the time-instant of experiencing?’
‘That meaning is not correct.’
‘For what reason, Venerable Sir, is it said: “The time-instant of experiencing is not the time-instant of dissipation, and the time-instant of dissipation is not the time-instant of experiencing”?’
‘Gautama! At which time-instant they experience, at that time-instant they do not dissipate; at which time-instant they dissipate, at that time-instant they do not experience—they experience at one time-instant, they dissipate at another time-instant. The time-instant of experiencing is one, the time-instant of dissipation is another. For that reason, up to: it is not the time-instant of experiencing, it is not the time-instant of dissipation.’
‘Venerable Sir, is the time-instant of experiencing for the inhabitants of hell the time-instant of dissipation, and the time-instant of dissipation the time-instant of experiencing?’
‘Gautama! That meaning is not correct.’
‘For what reason, Venerable Sir, is it said: “For the inhabitants of hell, the time-instant of experiencing is not the time-instant of dissipation, and the time-instant of dissipation is not the time-instant of experiencing”?’
‘Gautama! For the inhabitants of hell, at which time-instant they experience, at that time-instant they do not dissipate; at which time-instant they dissipate, at that time-instant they do not experience—they experience at one time-instant, they dissipate at another time-instant. The time-instant of experiencing is one, the time-instant of dissipation is another. For that reason, up to: it is not the time-instant of experiencing.’
In this way, up to the celestial beings.”